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1.05 Echo Diamond


Sirarchibald
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Who knows?

 

It's graded by IGI, which means I'd question colour - and probably clarity too. Cut is a mystery - who is grading it, and what do they mean by "very good make"?

 

If the "very good" cut grade is coming from IGI, same caution as per colour and clarity, and more: the Echo cut is a custom cut with 98 facets, which means that lab-developed cut grades (which are normally applied to traditional 57 facet cut diamonds) aren't really that applicable... if IGI has indeed applied it (normally labs do NOT grade custom cut diamonds).

 

I don't understand what you mean by "Priced me 6000".

 

If you meant that Robbins Brothers are asking you $6000 (incl. taxes? is it USD or another currency?) for the diamond, I think you can do better buying a traditionally cut diamond, unless you are truly really madly deeply in love with the look of "Echo".

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If you meant that Robbins Brothers are asking you $6000 (incl. taxes? is it USD or another currency?) for the diamond, I think you can do better buying a traditionally cut diamond, unless you are truly really madly deeply in love with the look of "Echo".

 

Just on the question of "look" -- the extra facets give off more points, but they're all smaller  You don't get something for nothing.  They can probably count this toward a high "light return" too, in the same sense that a disco mirrorball gives off lots of sparkles.

 

It seems this chain, West Coast and Texas, has been successful in concocting a marketing package that's purportedly a brand, but in essence replaces the traditional metrics of evaluating diamonds.   If you buy into what you see in one of their showrooms, you don't have much in the way of a common set of terms to even discuss the comparative merits of an Echo versus a classic-cut diamond.

 

Is the Robbins approach ethical? Well, the diamond industry allows "EGL" grading for specific marketing purposes, so it has to put up with this nonsense as well.  Somewhere, there's a parable about allowing a camel to stick his nose in your tent...

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Thank you very much for the information.

 

 

By make I mean polish and symmetry 

Very good cut grade was stated on the IGI cert I saw

yes 6000 USD

 

 

I really preferred the new look of the echo design over the traditional look when placing in the setting w/ 2 side diamonds.

 

Does GIA certify the Echo cut or just traditional cuts.

 

If so then I can't compare the two graders.

The Echo cut would be up to the buyer and seller over the price.

Edited by Sirarchibald
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Hello Sir --

 

GIA doesn't certify, but it grades.  It grades traditional diamonds, and offers an opinion on cut for standard, 57-facet rounds only.  They might issue a grading report on a modified cut (showing color, inclusions, dimensions), but that will not include an evaluation of the quality of that cut.  So the only party claiming the cut is "very good" is IGI, which is not known in this forum as an entity on a par with GIA or AGS... to put it mildly.

 

You can ask the vendor to document his opinion of what a GIA grading report would return, but the only way to be sure is to send the stone to GIA.  Unfortunately, that will take weeks to get back.  Otherwise, Robbins' employees will do their best to convince you that their "certifying" system is as good, and if you are at all susceptible to this approach, will bombard you with a blizzard of vaguely-worded documents purporting to support their position and extolling the Echo.

 

Not to say the Echo in front of you isn't a nice stone.  It's just that you don't know if it's equivalent to a $2K, $3K, or $6K GIA stone, and my suspicion is it's worth significantly less than a $6K GIA stone with proper documentation.

 

Using the diamond finder on this website, GIA F-color, I1 clarity,  1-carat stones run $2900-4700.  (But that's for real (GIA) F-color and I1 clarity, not IGI's "F" and "I1".  ...After all, someone's got to pay the store overhead!

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Thanks Sappire,

 

I have reviewed several GIA stones at the Robbins Brothers/ and other store in the price range of 6000$,  but after comparing the physical appearance of the Echo it was that much better to my eye.

 

If I am buying this IGI for life most likely, I would be willing to pay for the different design and should just live with the price and always know I can upgrade to a GIA later with RBs.

 

I think that I have convince myself that if you like the designed diamond you will just have to pay the stores price.

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Thanks Sappire,

 

I have reviewed several GIA stones at the Robbins Brothers/ and other store in the price range of 6000$,  but after comparing the physical appearance of the Echo it was that much better to my eye.

 

If I am buying this IGI for life most likely, I would be willing to pay for the different design and should just live with the price and always know I can upgrade to a GIA later with RBs.

 

I think that I have convince myself that if you like the designed diamond you will just have to pay the stores price.

The key question is what were you comparing to, and what path were you being led down to? What were the "GIA diamonds" graded? Were they as scrupulously clean as the stone you liked most?

 

Sometimes it's not so much a camel's snout but a greasy finger that sticks in the middle of a buyer's path.

 

It is true that if you want "a particular cut", often going with the cut originator or owner is the only option. It still deserves fair consideration - I have never seen a "custom" round cut whose look I prefer to a traditional 57-facet, never mind one for which it's worth paying a premium.

 

You are never "upgrading to a GIA". GIA does not have a monopoly on nicer stones; it simply is very consistent in how it assesses them, and this puts you (the buyer) in a position of greater strength.

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Although I'm sure GIA would be happy to grade an Echo diamond, there are two qualifiers.  First, they will only grade what's submitted to them.  Presumably the manufacturer has a relationship with IGI so THEY don't send in many of them.   They limit distribution to their own network so it's unlikely much of anyone else sends stones either.   The result is that although would be happy to grade one, it's unlikely you'll every find one where they actually have.

 

The other thing is the cut grade.  GIA won't assign one.  IGI apparently will.  It's up to you to decide if this is useful but if it is, you're not going to get it from a GIA inspection, even if YOU send one in.

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Hello Sir --

 

Sounds, from your comments, that you're about to have a Learning Experience.

 

I would suggest you look around a little bit more before you make your commitment.  $6,000USD isn't the worst you could do, but understand what I1 clarity is ... and how much lower an IGI grading is than the one that everyone else uses, both on clarity and color.  Or, try to get (in writing) a full money-back guarantee for a month, just so you can freely carry the stone into a few other diamond merchants for evaluation.  (Sometimes your credit card company can help you with this -- ask directly.)

 

Robbins is asking a large premium for a rock that doesn't even seem mediocre.  So, ask to see a stone that would be the equivalent to a GIA 1-carat, G-color, SI1 clarity grading (which is middle of the pack).  THEN you should decide if the Echo cut is worth the premium they want.

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