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Is This A Good Diamond?


hefan
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So my financee was not too happy with the ring I purchased and we decided to return it and get a new one. she would like to get a diamond that is as big and as shiney as possible. She does not care much about the color or clarity of the diamond as long as it does not affect the shininess of the stone too much.

 

So here are the new diamonds we are looking at a jeweler:

 

First one, 1.5 carat, J color, I1 (I see a little white cloud to the botton left of the diamond under magnifiying glasses, my fiancee couldn't see anything using naked eye), excellent cut, GIA certified. The dealer is quoting us $4800 for the stone.

 

Second one,1.5 carat, I color, I1 (I see some white lines under magnifiying glasses, my fiancee couldn't see anything using naked eye), very good cut, GIA certified. The dealer is quoting us $6100 for the stone.

 

So I have couple questionss.

 

First, the dealer told us that it's the cut and the size of the diamond that affects the shininess of the stone the most; color gives a kind of warm sparkle and clarity does not really matter much, is it true? Are the stones listed above going to lose a lot of shininess due to the lower grade clour and clarity?

 

Second, do you think the stones I quoted above are good deals? Which one do you think gives a higher value?

 

Thank you so much for all the help!

Edited by hefan
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I would agree with the dealer: colour in the D-Z range does not affect sparkle or brightness. Clarity above I2 won't either, with a few rare exceptions. If it does, you'll see it immediately: the stone looks dull.

 

The prices seem reasonable for a high street store. As to which one is the better value, which one do you prefer? An I colour will be significantly more expensive than a J, all else being equal, and this one is no exception.

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Thanks Davidelevi! We are actually preferring the J color stone since it's less expensive and seems to have a little bit more sparkle (probabely due to the cuts). So my question is if color and clarity does not affect sparkle and brightness much, why are people willing to pay such high premium for them? Is there anything about them (or effects on the stone) that I am missing?

 

Also when you said the prices seem reasonable for a high street store, do you mean I can buy a similar quality stone from some where else at a cheaper price (or I am just reading into it too much, hehe)?

 

Again thanks for all the help!

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clarity matters a lot, I'd suggest you not to buy anything graded below VS2, and GIA, HRD or IGi certified.

 

"I" clarity means "Important inclusions & cracks visible to the naked eye" and the diamond like that does not have light + color dispersing performance as it should have.

So big, but "dead" diamond does not meet the criteria "shiny".

6 thousand dollars is a lot of money, and the difference between 1 and 1,5 carats is less than 1 millimeter in diameter, so I'd suggest you to go for 1 carat but the stone of better clarity...

 

BUT -if she wants the stone to be shiny and big, maybe you could check "radiant" cut instead of "round" cut... Costs much less per carat, and is very shiny.

 

good info about clarity from Antwerp here: http://www.ajediam.com/diamond_clarity_grading_chart.html

 

and the actual picture of a stone with I1 clarity you can check here:http://www.israel-diamonds.com/product/Diamond/sg/32510.aspx?ReturnUrl=%2fsearch%2fdiamonds%2fdefault.aspx%3floc%3dleft

 

or here:http://www.israel-diamonds.com/product/Diamond/sg/35294.aspx?ReturnUrl=%2fsearch%2fdiamonds%2fdefault.aspx%3floc%3dleft

 

Color that is a bit tinted can be good in yellow metal setting, and some fluorescence is desirable if their color is graded below K... for it makes the stone to appear whiter than it really is...

Edited by Aujesuis
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Also, to me it seems like the dealers are marketing the "cut" too much - and I guess it's because there are so few good quality diamonds among all that are mined...

I have to admit I never saw a woman here having a 1+ ct diamond with inclusions visible to the naked eye.

 

Clear stone can always be re-cut if the current "fashion" for cut changes (as it was in the 1960-es - when a bit shallow cut was preferable for that way the diamond looked bigger - so that "cut fashion" can change again)

 

Also do not forget to ask for certificate that proves there are no "temporary treatments" on the stone, too... aka silicone to fill the cracks, or even infused into the stone to optically hide impurities...

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I'm solidly with Davide and your dealer. Buy what you like. The reason some people are willing to pay more for higher clarity and/or color is becasue that's what THEY like. You're in the minority here but that doesn't make you wrong and that's what brings down your price. That's a feature, not a problem. It doesn't make them wrong either. It's a big world and there's room for lots of different tastes.

 

Excellent cut I1/J's are actually fairly hard to find by the way, especially just over an important weight point like 1.50. For example, in the database here, a search for 1.50-1.60/J/I1/GIA/excellent doesn't produce an offer for a single stone for sale. If we change that spec to H/SI1 and leave everything else the same there are hundreds (and they cost on the order of $15,000 by the way).

Edited by denverappraiser
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I am also with your dealer. And, in case you're wondering, the reason the cut is such an integral factor in the shininess of a diamond is that, when you look at a diamond through a microscope, the triangular shapes you see (facets, or the smooth surface areas of the diamond) are where the cut, polishing and positioning take place. If you shine a light through the diamond, the reflection and refraction of the light are determined by the depth, width and uniformity of the facets, which in turn control the diamond’s luster (its ability to disperse light and sparkle). This may explain why you are seeing a "white cloud" or "white lines" under a magnifying glass.

 

Hope this helps...

Edited by Encore DT
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Thank you so much for all the help guys! I am much more comfortable now. Just one more quick question. I was reading previous posts on the forum and some of you said that inclusinveness can some times make a diamond murky. Does the murkiness affect a stone's shininess/brightness and does it happen often? Or it's like david said, if it's the case I'll see it immediately since the stone looks dull. Thanks again!

Edited by hefan
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Inclusions affect transparency, and transparency affects brightness. Some more than others. I1 is a big category and there is always SOMETHING going on with the stone that caused the grade. It may or may not affect the brightness in a significant way but it's correct that it might. You’ll notice that light return, scintillation and fire are NOT part of the GIA grading system and the OGI thing you quoted is purely based on the proportions of the stone. It has nothing to do with the internal features. This is part of what the dealer is for. Ask. Look at the stone. Have your own chosen expert look at the stone. Compare it to others. You cannot reasonably buy a diamond, especially an I1, based purely on the GIA report.

Edited by denverappraiser
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Thanks! We already looked at stone once and it looked pretty good then. We are going to look at it again and have it appraised today as well. What type of questions do you think we should ask the dealer and appraiser? Like how bad the inclusion is at affecting stone's transpanrancy and brilliance?

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I think one pretty telling question (and test) is to ask the dealer to show you an equivalently sized/cut/coloured VS2 or higher. Can you see the difference? Can they point it out to you?

 

BTW - here is a relatively dull stone (it also happens to be an I2). It has a lovely colour, but it just doesn't "do it"

 

r3447h.jpg

 

and here is an eye-clean I1 with a lot of sparkle - visible even in the photo.

 

r4129e.jpg

 

A video, so you get an idea of what it looks like "in motion":

 

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