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Princess Cut Advice Buying In 3 Days


TheRealDonV
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Hello. First off thanks for taking the time to read my post. I am in the market to purchase a princess cut stone. ( this is my first diamond purchase) and I need some outside advice:

 

here is the two stones I have been looking at:

 

Diamond 1

 

Carat Weight : 0.75

Cut : Very Good

Color : I

Clarity : SI2

Price($) : 1,366.67

Lab Name : GIA

Certificate No :2141311494

Depth : 77.80

Table : 80.00

Polish : Very Good

Symmetry : Very Good

Girdle : TN-XTK

Culet : None

Fluorescence : Faint

Ratio : 1.03

Measurements : 5.00x4.87x3.79

 

Diamond 2

 

Carat Weight : 0.77

Cut : Excellent

Color : H

Clarity : SI2

Price($) : 1,774.38

Lab Name : GIA

Certificate No :1146226517

Depth : 75.10

Table : 70.00

Polish : Excellent

Symmetry : Excellent

Girdle : M-TK

Culet : None

Fluorescence : None

Ratio : 1.01

Measurements : 4.88x4.84x3.64

 

 

1-What is the ideal depth, table, and girdle for a princess cut of this size?

2-How much does the fluorescense matter?

3-Is the excellent( vs very good) rating on polish, symmetry and cut worth a 25% upgrade?

 

4-Any other advice is appreciated.

Thanks again for the help

Edited by TheRealDonV
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0. GIA does not grade cut on princesses, so you need to ask whoever put that "Very Good" or "Excellent" what it means, what they looked at to award it and then decide whether it is something you can trust.

 

1. No such thing for table and depth, unfortunately. You can specify "extremes to avoid" but they don't tell you anything about what happens in between (e.g. "avoid depth below 60 and above 85" doesn't tell you whether 75.10 is better or worse than 77.80). And you can always find stones that look extremely nice although the table/depth are well within the "avoid" range. Final nail in the coffin is that neither table nor depth actually matter much in terms of light performance/cut quality; the most meaningful parameters are crown and pavilion angles (and their interaction); for some unknown reason GIA does not report them on non-round stones.

 

As far as girdle is concerned, not a very different story. Avoiding extremes (ETN/VTN/VTK/ETK) and large variation (more than three grades) are rules of thumb, but they may lead you to discard perfectly viable stones: there may be a minute portion of the girdle that is (say) VTN in the middle of a side, and the rest is MED. End result: grade of VTN/MED that looks "bad" given both rules of thumb above, but in reality there is no problem.

 

2. Not an issue, first of all because "faint" is - well - faint, secondly because in H/I stones blue fluorescence may actually make them look slightly whiter (str and above) and thirdly because fluorescence is rarely an issue anyway - read this GIA article http://lgdl.gia.edu/pdfs/W97_fluoresce.pdf if you really want the details.

 

3. Polish and symmetry - no. A few percent at most. Cut - see point 0. above, but it may well be one of the main causes of the price difference. H vs I is about 10%. The other major price driver in SI-clarity stones is the visibility of inclusions, but there is no way of knowing anything about that without seeing the diamond(s).

 

4. With fancy cuts (i.e. non-rounds), you are much better off working with people who can and will call stones in for inspection, because of the lack of information on cut requires seeing the stone, Same for SI-graded clarity. The chances are a relatively small diamond with a "busy" brilliant-style cut will be OK, but there are some stones where the inclusion is clearly visible and possibly bothering.

 

FWIW, purely based on the info available in your post, I'd be tempted to go for the H/0.77 - it just "looks better on paper". Whether it is, and whether you would prefer it to the other diamond in reality is unfortunately not answerable without you seeing and comparing the two.

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An 80% table indicates that the stone face up opaque and glassy. I would also like to know the nature of the SI-2 inclusions:

 

Location

Size

Coloration

 

You will need much more information if you want to make a wise purchase decision.

Edited by barry
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Thank you both for the replies.

 

Do these look like good deals to you?

 

Barry it says you are from New york. Both of these are from B2C which has its address in NY. Have you any thoughts about them?

 

I found 2 others that are perhaps worth throwing in the mix:

 

Diamond 3

 

 

Carat Weight : 0.73

Cut : Excellent

Color : I

Clarity : VS2

Price($) : 1,580.33

Lab Name : GIA

Certificate No :2131660742

Depth : 71.00

Table : 68.00

Polish : Excellent

Symmetry : Very Good

Girdle :

Culet : None

Fluorescence : None

Ratio : 1.00

Measurements : 5.00x4.99x3.54

 

 

Diamond 4

 

Carat Weight : 0.72

Cut : Excellent

Color : E

Clarity : VS2

Price($) : 1,910.83

Lab Name : GIA

Certificate No :2111752944

Depth : 76.10

Table : 73.00

Polish : Excellent

Symmetry : Excellent

Girdle : STK-TK

Culet : None

Fluorescence : Strong Blue

Ratio : 1.03

Measurements : 4.84x4.72x3.59

Edited by TheRealDonV
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On paper #3 looks interesting too - and it bypasses the issue of the SI2 clarity. The problem is that you cannot buy a princess cut on paper, because in practice you know nothing about the cut with the information on the report.

 

It's a bit like buying a car where all you know is "red Toyota, 25,000 miles, 3 litre engine, wheel size 205/50 R17".

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yes thanks for the opinions. I sent the following email to the dealer:

 

I am looking for something that is shiny and bright to the naked eye( I don’t care as much about it at 10x mag) as it’s for an engagement ring. Please give me your jewelers opinion on the stones below. Also I was told that GIA does not grade cut on princess, so I am wondering who looked at it and what they looked at to award it that?

 

 

I like to know the nature of the SI-2 inclusions:

 

Location

Size

Coloration

 

 

I will post the response when I get it on monday

 

Edit here is the response:

 

Yes the GIA does not grade cut on princess cut diamond,but we have graded cuts on our sight to make the customers search easier and simplier,as most of the customers when searching for a diamond looks what is the cut graded on a diamond is it excellent or very good or good etc.

The cut is graded by our expert gemologist according to the merit of a particular diamond.

 

The stock numbers which you have given us out of 4 diamonds, stock # diamond 1 and stock # diamond 3 are not available.

 

Stock # diamond 2 is a very good diamond and also 100% eye clean.

 

 

Stock # diamond 4 is also a good stone 100 % eye clean but has a strong blue flouresense.

 

Suggest to go for stock # diamond 2.

 

When I asked him for the inclusions here is what he said:

 

The diamond is 100% eye clean as informed before.

 

The diamond stock # diamond 2 as it is SI 2 the inclusions are there but not seen by naked eye.

 

Location - feather on pavilion.

pinpoint spread on the pavilion.

 

Size of the inclusion is not big as it is seen only under a magnifying loop.

 

Color is white looks better then H color,This diamond looks like a G color.

 

 

 

one more thing on diamond 2 I noticed the clarity char was cloud. which Im sure is from the pinpoint spread on the pavilion. should I be concerned about this location?

Edited by TheRealDonV
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