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Emerald Cut 3.0 Carat


Oxymoronic
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I've been looking for an emerald cut of around 3.0 carat's and debating whether to buy online or at a bricks and mortar jewellers.

 

I now think I've found the perfect diamond with a GIA Report

 

10.22x6.71x4.60

Carat: 3.01

Color:F

Clarity: VS1

Table: 75%

Depth: 68.1%

Culet: No

Girdle" Very thin to extremely thick

Flouresence: None

Polish: Good

Symmetry: Good

 

I have seen the diamond in person and it has a great color and is by no means lifeless given the large table.

 

The questions I have is whether it is a true statement that the GIA do not grade the cut of Emerald Cut diamonds or other "fancies"? Also, I had been looking for something with Very Good polish or Symmetry. Again, should I be too concerned?

 

Thanks, Oxymoronic.

 

P.S. The price I was quoted and saw was less than the price of the same diamond offered online by a couple of the Online dealers.

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I've been looking for an emerald cut of around 3.0 carat's and debating whether to buy online or at a bricks and mortar jewellers.

 

I now think I've found the perfect diamond with a GIA Report

 

Thanks, Oxymoronic.

I’m not understanding the question here. You’ve got a stone that you apparently like and are wondering where to buy it. Your local B&M is cheaper, which is certainly a vote for them, but you haven’t said why you are considering the online seller. Surely the local store would also be both more convenient and faster so, unless there are some more variables that you haven’t let on, this seems like a pretty easy question.

 

Neil

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Just to add one more thing, no matter where you purchase it, make sure you get it insured. The girdle has quite a variance and it is likely that the stone could chip with wear or setting it. If the stone did happen to chip it could fall below the 3.00 ct. weight range by repairing it and there by effecting the value of the stone quite a bit in the future.

Edited by jan
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And one more: I suspect the reason why the symmetry is rated "good" may also be because of the girdle. I doubt you'd be able to see the difference between a "good" polish or symmetry and a "very good" with the naked eye, though.

 

Since Neil has not mentioned it - get an independent appraisal before you close!!! With that kind of stone (and I assume price), you definitely want to be aware of any potential issues.

Edited by davidelevi
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Thanks all.

 

You've given me comfort that the rating of G/G for polish/symmetry shouldn't be a problem. I think I gave myself comfort that a 75% table wasn't a problem in this case.

 

Thanks for the comment about the girdle variance. Is this really a problem? Do diamonds often chip?

 

However, could you comment why it should be independently appraised? I have done lots of searching of all the internet sites and the price appears good against the internet. Is it because the GIA report could be subject to variance? Is it because the dealer has done/could do a bait and switch? Is it for peace of mind?

 

Finally, I was reading some more comments about the RAP sheet. How can I find out about what the RAP sheet price is?

 

 

Thanks, Oxymoronic.

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Diamonds are very hard, but also quite brittle; when hit (e.g. when setting them) they can chip; of course, the thinner the portion of stone that receives the impact, the likelier it is that it will break. A very thin girdle, depending on where it is thin and how the stone is set, may be something to be wary of.

 

Girdle variance in and of itself should not concern you overmuch, but it may be that the stone has been cut more with an eye towards hitting the magical "3.00" than towards getting a nice looking stone. If you are happy with the price and with how the stone looks, then don't start overfussing about it; however, since you would be paying a premium simply because when put on a scale the first digit to come up is "3" rather than "2", I'd want some reassurance that the stone is well cut.

 

We can assume that the price is fair, but a stone's look depends a lot on cut; since I believe this is an important purchase, I'd be quite disappointed in finding that there is another stone that looks much better and costs less because it's a well cut 2.85.

 

The easiest way of getting some reassurance on this is to get an indipendent expert that is able to compare your stone, both subjectively and objectively (e.g. ASET), to similar ones and to give you an unbiased view as to what you are buying and of its pluses and minuses (including if relevant girdle variance/fragility). By any means, if you are an expert yourself or if the money is pocket change to you, don't worry and buy the stone; for the sake of a couple of hundred dollars, that is reassurance that I would want to have.

 

Bait and switch and grading inaccuracies do happen, but by choosing GIA you are reasonably safe on the latter, and I assume you trust the jeweller from which you want to buy, since your questions seem to be more around technical aspects than on whether you are getting a good deal and on whether you should trust this dealer.

 

Disclaimer: I am not an appraiser nor in any way connected with the appraising profession. ^_^

 

The Rap sheet is available through subscription only (~$200) and - although Martin Rappaport would certainly disagree - is quickly becoming an irrelevance given the much greater transparency on prices given by the internet. Your best information about "the going price" for diamonds similar to the one you intend to buy is the price range charged by the various internet retailers.

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You are making a basic assumption that everything important to know about the stone is included on that report from GIA. This may be true in your case, it depends on how you like to make decisions, but it’s not with most, and it’s definitely not with pros. No dealer with any sense will make a final commitment to buying a stone without seeing it in person or with the eyes of their own expert.

 

I’m sure you’ve already done this but take a look at the pricing tables and you’ll notice that similarly graded GIA stones will range in prices by 25% or more, even with offers from the same dealer. This difference has to do with off-report things like quality of cutting, durability concerns and just plain beauty of the stone when compared to others like it. These are the very topics you’re asking about. No one can answer these issues without seeing the stone and it’s not a matter of massaging the data on the report to get where you want to go. It comes from experience. This leaves you 4 choices:

 

#1 You can rely on the advice and experience of the dealer.

#2 You can rely your own expertise.

#3 You can hire your own expert assistance.

#4 You can just take your chances and hope it works out ok.

 

Choice #3 leads to the office of an independent appraiser and the annoying possibility that you will end up paying an IA to tell you things that you already knew. Then again, they might tell you something that saves you from a multi-thousand dollar mistake. Sort of like a second opinion from a doctor who agrees with the first. This doesn't mean that the second doc was a waste of money but I guess it depends on your level of confidence in the first.

 

Neil

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I've been looking for an emerald cut of around 3.0 carat's and debating whether to buy online or at a bricks and mortar jewellers.

 

I now think I've found the perfect diamond with a GIA Report

 

10.22x6.71x4.60

Carat: 3.01

Color:F

Clarity: VS1

Table: 75%

Depth: 68.1%

Culet: No

Girdle" Very thin to extremely thick

Flouresence: None

Polish: Good

Symmetry: Good

 

I have seen the diamond in person and it has a great color and is by no means lifeless given the large table.

 

The questions I have is whether it is a true statement that the GIA do not grade the cut of Emerald Cut diamonds or other "fancies"? Also, I had been looking for something with Very Good polish or Symmetry. Again, should I be too concerned?

 

Thanks, Oxymoronic.

 

P.S. The price I was quoted and saw was less than the price of the same diamond offered online by a couple of the Online dealers.

 

 

 

 

I've always been a fan of actual measurements on an emerald cut rather than the questions of G vs. VG on Polish or symmetry. We can SEE a 10.22mm length vs. a 9.7mm length.

 

If chipping a diamond were so prevelant then noone would buy these things and they certainly wouldn't cost as much.

 

I'd like to see a study on the variance of girdle thicknesses relating to the increase in statistical chance of chipping a stone, and at what rate, and if it is enough to ever be concerned about. Because all girdles have edges no matter what thickeness. So no fear factor here on thins vs. mediums, vs very thicks and all in between.

 

If flo is of no concern (no concern here) then one other diamond of note to look at is:

 

3.03 GIA F VS1 65.7/63 vg/vg/mb 10.36x6.89x4.53.

 

Marty

CEO/Pres

Diamond Brokerage Service, Inc

www.dbsdiamonds.com

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Hi all,

I have some different points of view here.

In terms of the girdle- having such a variance in the girdle thickness on an emerald cut does not necessarily indicate a problem.

If a round diamond has such a large variance on the girdle, something is cock-eyed.

But remember, the girdle on an emerald cut turns corners- so the thin part of the girdle might be no problem at all.

Any diamond can chip- or any diamond can be exposed to rough treatment with no ill affects.

 

 

I also disagree with some of the things said here about appraisers.

Just because someone calls themselves an appraiser, does not mean that they are a good source if information about diamonds.

Neil is amazing- if you found someone like him, it would be well worth your while using their eyes to guide you.

Sad to say, but appraisers with Neil's experience and integrity are few and far between.

I have had some personal experience with appraisers right here on 47th street that was horrible.

 

The real issue is that you need to trust the person you're buying it from.

If the seller is a crook, an appraiser might be of no service at all- a crooked seller could deny that the stone you bring back is the stone they sold you.

Or, you might love the diamond, go to an appraiser who's taste is different than yours and be put off a great deal ( if this is a great deal)

 

 

For sure appraisers can provide a valuable service- but I don't feel that your situation necessarily calls for an appraiser. Using an appraiser to verify a purchase overlooks the fact that you really need to make sure the seller is ok.

 

Research the seller- the fact that he actually has the diamond and you've seen it is a great thing.

The fact that his price is better than internet does sound ...unusual.

Make sure you get a written money back guarantee.

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ok - thanks for all the advice. I think I have found the perfect diamond. The prior diamond was more expensive and they were unwilling to budge on price.

 

GIA

3.00 carat

F

VS1

Polish - Excellent

Symm - Good

Fl - None

Depth: 62.7

Table: 63

Girdle: Medium Thick

Culet: None

 

My only concern is that the price including 2 0.4 carat traps (similarly VS1, Fs) and a platinum setting with split claws is totaling $54,000 which seems low compared to what I've seen elsewhere.

 

I will certainly be getting an independent appraisal to put my mind at rest but was recommended to call GIA and ask for an independent appraiser that they'd recommend.

 

Is this a good route or would someone recommend a different route of finding a good appraiser?

 

Thanks, Matt

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Congratulations. :P

 

GIA doesn't train appraisers and I'm sure they don't recommend them. They train gemologists, which is a decidedly different issue. Here's a few good places to look for a qualified appraiser.

 

www.americangemsociety.org

www.najaappraisers.com

www.appraisers.org

www.americangemregistry.com

 

Neil

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Is this from a brick and mortar store- and have you seen the diamond?

 

Your concern about the price is well warranted.

I believe the price is just too low- and that is actually a very bad thing- especially if you are buying online.

 

I'm sure that the organizations Neil gave you are populated by competent people- I ever meant to imply that there are not good appraisers out there- just that an appraiser can't help people that get ripped off by dishonest, or incompetent sellers.

ON the other hand, an honest competent dealer makes an appraiser far less necessary.

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I have indeed seen the diamond on 47th Street and the GIA report and have confirmed that the report number on GIA's website confirms the details on the diamond i.e. the report itself hasn't been tampered with. They're also fine with me getting it independently appraised and didn't try to get me to see their preferred appraiser or anything untoward.

 

Neil, I will start searching on the site's you recommend right now.

 

Thanks!

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I'd really want to make sure the GIA report matches the diamond.

I have heard a lot of horror stories about the street level sellers on 47th street- and the price is below what a legit dealer would be charging.

I would definitely make sure that you have the diamond examined by an independent expert. Just because the report is on the GIA website does not mean the diamond you saw matches the report.

As far as finding a qualified, honest appraiser on 47th Street...well, good luck.

 

Although I am totally suspicious on your behalf- I wish you the best!

I hope you prove me wrong.

 

 

PS- About 8 years ago, I did go with a client to Macy's on 34th Street. They had an appraisal department, and they appraised a diamond we were selling him.

If they are still doing this, I'd recommend them.

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