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Diamond Cut Just Changed


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HI everyone,

 

I must say that there are very few good forums like this one that cover the nerve wrecking topic of diamonds and engagement rings. So thanks for keeping this going.

 

My question is rather lengthy so I'll try to keep it brief. About a month ago I went to a reputable jewelry chain in Chicago to look for a ring. I found the ring that I was looking for along with a diamond - a 1.25 carat, G, SI, Round. The diamond was mounted to a solitaire and at the time when I was looking at it had a small, credit card size, certificate from EGL. One of the specs from the card that I remember was that is was a very good cut. I then came back a week later to sign on the dotted line and proceed with the process. I was having the ring made from scratch because I wanted it to be in platinum which they didn't carry in stock. While the ring was being made I asked for the full certificate and the store manager told me that the diamond would need to be sent out to EGL to be looked at again and then I would get my cert in about a week or so. Before the diamond went out I saw it as a loose diamond without the solitaire mounting to which it was mounted before.

 

Fast forward to this week I was suppose to pick up the ring and diamond today and when I called yesterday the manager told me that the diamond is on its way back but while EGL was certifying the diamond the diamond was certified as a Ideal cut and he mentioned that the actual value of the diamond increased because of this. So it went from a very good cut to Ideal. I understand that the grading of the cut is a bit subjective but can the grading change that much? Another thing that seems a bit interesting to me is that the store does not want payment for the difference for what I paid for the diamond to what its worth - I thought there is no such thing as a free lunch in this world. Don't get me wrong I don't mind the value and that I don't have to make up the difference but how is it possible that they are selling me a higher value diamond for less? Lastly, I obtained the cert # and looked it up on the EGL website and on the comments I saw "Grading as mounting permits" - but when I saw the diamond it was loose and it appears that it was put back on the mounting for the grading - seems a bit strange.

 

I would really appreciate some sort of feedback on this dilemma as I am about to propose within the next few weeks and if I have to abort this whole deal then I want to do it soon.

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EGL is not very precise about their various cut grades. A cut grade of ‘very good’ on a mounted stone isn’t telling you much. If you don’t understand their system (I don’t), call them up and ask them to explain it. While you’re on the phone with them, ask about the ‘grading as mounting permits’ question. My guess is that it’s a typo but I suppose it’s possible that the jeweler sent it in while in the mounting or simply ordered the report without sending it in for a new inspection.

 

As far as ‘value’ goes, it depends on what you mean by value. Any statement of value must contain an element of what it’s worth, to whom, when and under what circumstances. If they had already sold you the stone, I’m not surprise that they didn’t retroactively raise the price because that’s a way to annoy customers. They made money on you and they want to keep you coming back. With most appraisals, the definition of value has to do with the expected cost for your insurance company to replace a stone or piece of jewelry with another of like kind and quality in the case of a loss. This again goes to the scale and exactly what they mean by their terms but in most cases an EGL-Ideal will cost more to replace than an EGL-Very Good.

 

Clear as mud, eh?

 

Neil

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EGL is not very precise about their various cut grades. A cut grade of ‘very good’ on a mounted stone isn’t telling you much. If you don’t understand their system (I don’t), call them up and ask them to explain it. While you’re on the phone with them, ask about the ‘grading as mounting permits’ question. My guess is that it’s a typo but I suppose it’s possible that the jeweler sent it in while in the mounting or simply ordered the report without sending it in for a new inspection.

 

As far as ‘value’ goes, it depends on what you mean by value. Any statement of value must contain an element of what it’s worth, to whom, when and under what circumstances. If they had already sold you the stone, I’m not surprise that they didn’t retroactively raise the price because that’s a way to annoy customers. They made money on you and they want to keep you coming back. With most appraisals, the definition of value has to do with the expected cost for your insurance company to replace a stone or piece of jewelry with another of like kind and quality in the case of a loss. This again goes to the scale and exactly what they mean by their terms but in most cases an EGL-Ideal will cost more to replace than an EGL-Very Good.

 

Clear as mud, eh?

 

Neil

 

 

Thanks Neil,

 

I'm a MBA grad and I know a thing about business is that regardless what industry they are in they are there to make money - its a simple concept. I guess what I was trying to say in my loong explanation is that if they had the diamond why wouldn't they go the extra step to verify it prior to selling it to me? Cause now there is about a 3-4K difference between what I bought it for and what it is "worth" now. I find that gap a bit strange. I'm going to see the diamond mounted and ready to go home with me on Thursday but for now I'm providing the specs on the diamond and please let me know your thoughts. This is the info I pulled from the online EGL database.

 

Weight1.23 ct. ShapeROUND BRILLIANT ColorG-H ClaritySI1 Measurements6.86 - 6.82 x 4.24 mm Depth62.0 Table59.0 Crown14.5 Pavilion43.3 GirdleTHIN TO MEDIUM FACETED PolishVERY GOOD SymmetryVERY GOOD FluorescenceFAINT CuletNONE Cut GradeIDEAL

Comments: GRADED AS MOUNTING PERMITS.

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‘Worth’ is the key.

 

My MBA program was remarkably light on appraisal theory and it’s been several decades since I was there (Leeds school of business, 1984 – Go Buffs :blink: ) but think back to Marketing 101. What is value? What makes one widget worth more than another? Is a hot dog worth more at the ballpark than at the grocery store? Darned right it is. Who gets to say what that dog is worth? Assuming it’s worth $6 at the park, is that evidence that it’s a bargain at the 7-11 for $2.50 or at the grocery for $0.50? Would it help if some guy at the grocery store gave you an ‘appraisal’ that said it’s worth $6?

 

Jewelers sell things for less than they are ‘worth’ all the time. That doesn’t mean that they could get higher prices, only that somebody, somewhere, theoretically could. Woohoo. For most people this isn’t very useful information.

 

Note on your stone. EGL-USA doesn’t assign split grades (G-H color) on their flagship ‘certificate’ and they don’t issue that report on stones that are examined in the mounting. That’s not data from the full certificate that you requested.

 

Neil

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Usually the EGL mini certs don`t require you to send the diamond back for a full report. It is just a matter of paying for a full report.

 

This part is also key: "Comments: GRADED AS MOUNTING PERMITS."

Since the supposed original diamond had already been graded this shouldn`t have been an issue.

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Usually the EGL mini certs don`t require you to send the diamond back for a full report. It is just a matter of paying for a full report.

 

This part is also key: "Comments: GRADED AS MOUNTING PERMITS."

Since the supposed original diamond had already been graded this shouldn`t have been an issue.

 

I'm hoping that the information online which I pulled isn't what the new full certificate has. According to the jeweler he told me that I will be receiving a portfolio with a "Ideal" certificate as well as a full certificate.

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