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1.77, IF, G, Ideal cut, Strong blue fluorescence


NewSucker
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Hello,

I just purchased an engagement ring from James Allen everything seemed to be within the requirements set by my girlfriend however James Allen didn't give me the gia certificate until after I purchased it and it says strong blue fluorescence.

 

I looked at the pictures on their website the diamond looks great. I've since searched fluorescence and realized that it may be undesirable, and in direct sunlight can alter the color.

 

I'm not worried about black lights. However I am worried about paying a premium for something that might not be as sparkly, clean, clear, or hazy and milky. And second to that the color change in sunlight, if the whole hue of the diamond changes I'm not sure how I feel about that.

 

Are you able to look at the pictures on their site and tell me if you think it suffers from the milky hazy negative affects.

I've read people say that 0.2% of fluorescent diamonds suffer from these effects then I've read on this forum say if it's strong fluorescent it will suffer these effects.

 

I am able to return this. Thanks

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/cushion-cut/1.77-carat-g-color-if-clarity-sku-12637396

 

20211128_171524.jpg

Edited by NewSucker
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27 minutes ago, NewSucker said:

Are you able to look at the pictures on their site and tell me if you think it suffers from the milky hazy negative affects.

There is no way of telling from the JA pictures, since they've been taken in an environment with limited-to-no-UV. On the other hand, unfiltered sunlight ("open air") is rich in UV, and it will take you only a few seconds to see whether the stone is affected.

27 minutes ago, NewSucker said:

I've read people say that 0.2% of fluorescent diamonds suffer from these effects then I've read on this forum say if it's strong fluorescent it will suffer these effects.

I'm not sure where on this forum you may have read that. I have never seen statistics published on what percentage of fluorescent diamonds have significant effects on transparency, but pretty much everyone here would refer you to this study by GIA that confirms that they are indeed rare.

https://www.gia.edu/gems-gemology/winter-1997-fluorescence-diamonds-moses

29 minutes ago, NewSucker said:

if the whole hue of the diamond changes I'm not sure how I feel about that

I would say that there is only one way to find out... and that is by looking at it. Some people (myself included) quite like the effect. Others don't. Nothing wrong with either reaction.

30 minutes ago, NewSucker said:

However I am worried about paying a premium for something that might not be as sparkly, clean, clear, or hazy and milky.

Well, the question is: "did you?" Generally, strongly fluorescent diamonds go for a significant discount vs. otherwise similar but non-fluorescent ones. Your diamond appears to be 'premium' in other respects (clarity, squareness, to some extent colour - possibly cut quality).

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I agree with Davide above but I'll go down another detour. You paid a premium for IF.  Possibly a fairly healthy premium.  That was offset by a discount for the fluorescence. Personally I like fluoro, I think it's cool, but it drives down the price. I would push for a discount as much as the next guy just because I could, but I might choose a fluorescent stone even if it didn't come at a lower price. You didn't pay a premium, you got a discount.  What you paid a premium for is IF, an attribute that has no affect on sparkle, clean, clear, hazy, or milky. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to talk you off the IF cliff but if price is your hot button, why did you end with this particular stone?

 

Edited by denverappraiser
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My hot button would be if it was milky or hazy and didn't look like the best diamond it could be because it had florescence, I could afford a diamond that doesn't look dull and meet the requirements of my gf. But I thought I was getting the biggest stone of her requirements to find out it may look like a nondiamond because of a feature that doesn't show up in the dealers pictures.

 

If it is IF wouldn't that mean that it doesn't have the negative attributes of the fluorescence? Or do I not understand that right.

 

I ended up with this stone because I was told fl to vvs1, d to g, over 1 c, cushion cut.

 

I didn't know that fluorescence has a visibility past a special bulb, ie. Sun. And that it can make the stone look milky, hazy, not sparkle.

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20 minutes ago, NewSucker said:

If it is IF wouldn't that mean that it doesn't have the negative attributes of the fluorescence? Or do I not understand that right

The two things are completely independent. "Internally Flawless" means that there are no inclusions visible in the diamond at 10x magnification. Fluorescence - and its possible effects - are happening at the atomic lattice level, and the reason why you get the haze is (hugely simplified) that the amount of visible light being generated by the fluorescence is high enough to interfere with the external light being reflected and refracted by the faceting.

The good thing is that not only the overblue effect is rare, but JA will take the stone back with a minimum amount of fuss IF it's not something you like.

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The hazy look people worry about is rare but no, it's not incompatible with IF. The GIA report doesn't mention it in any case but the test is simple enough. Look at it in the sunlight. If it fails, send it back. By the way, don't aim just for direct overhead sunlight. Look at it in the shade too. Your eyes work a little different in very bright light and it's easy to mistake the effect. If you're in doubt, consider booking an appointment with an independent appraiser while you're still in the return period. They'll know what to look for and should be able to explain the issues to you. Book your appointment now, some are kind of busy and there aren't that many of us out there (an IA is not the same as a jewelry store). I think JA gives 60 days but I'm not certain of that. They're a very cooperative company.  At the end of the day, if it bugs you, send it back. It doesn't even matter why. There are plenty of stones out there without fluoro if you prefer. 

Here's 524 stones that meet those specs. There must be more that led you this one. Again, I'm not trying to talk you out of this one, it look like it's probably lovely but, as you point out, there's a premium attached to it. IF is overkill in terms of what it looks like, a VS2 will look the same to the unaided eye, and G is underkill. Most people can see the difference between an D and a G if they look carefully. It's an unusual choice.  

https://www.diamondreview.com/diamonds

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