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lilouch123

Advice before buying an diamond

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Hello !

I need advice from people with experience.

I want to buy diamond for my futur spouse.

My budget is around 4000 euros but if there si something really nice, I can make an effort.

A diamand merchant, that I met told me that he found a great diamond. The features are below in the GIA certificate but briefly :

  • D -  Internally Flawless - Very strong blue - Shape : peer - 1,05ct
  • Polish and symmetry are set to GOOD.

He ask me about 7000 dollars. He told me it's an excellent price and a nice deal !
I trust him.
However, when I look on the internet, it turns out that the very strong blue for D - flawless is something negative for the diamond and I said to myself that's why maybe the price is "low".

I don't know if I should buy it or not.

What do you think ? Good deal ? Not good deal ?

68299917_363633674318072_3259461117704929280_n.jpg

Edited by lilouch123
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Hi there, welcome to Diamond Review!

Couple of potential alarm bells ringing from that report, in addition to the fluorescence:

1. We (and possibly you) know nothing about the cut of the diamond, other than symmetry being graded good - and that's not a good place to start. Can you see the diamond and compare it to others? Alternatively, can the vendor provide you with good quality photos and ideally a video? 

2. The report is over 15 years old. This is not necessarily a problem, but: A) has the diamond been sitting for 15 years in a retailer's safe? If so, is it because there is something wrong with it? Or B} has the diamond been sitting on somebody's finger for 15 years, in which case is it still "flawless"? It takes very very little to have a tiny chip or scratch that makes that "flawless" grade go away.

3. The reason why the fluorescence has a negative impact on price is that sometimes it makes stones go cloudy or oily in natural light. This may or may not be the case here, but if it does not everybody likes the effect. Did you ask the vendor?

The price is reasonable, and one reason why it is so "cheap" compared to other D/IF 1.0x pears is very clearly the fluorescence, but the polish and symmetry grades contribute too. Take a look through this list of nearly 150 comparable diamonds for Weight/Clarity/Colour and see what happens to prices when you filter for fluorescence, polish or symmetry...

https://www.diamondreview.com/diamonds?sortOrder=price&sortDesc=1&fShape=Pear&fCaratLo=1.00&fCaratHi=1.10&fColorLo=D&fColorHi=D&fClarityLo=FL&fClarityHi=IF&fCutLo=&fCutHi=poor&fDepthLo=0.0&fDepthHi=100.0&fTableLo=0.0&fTableHi=100.0&fSymLo=&fSymHi=poor&fPolLo=&fPolHi=poor&fCulLo=&fCulHi=vlarge&fFlrLo=&fFlrHi=vstrong&fPriceLo=0&fPriceHi=1000000000&adv=1

2 hours ago, lilouch123 said:

I don't know if I should buy it or not.

What do you think ? Good deal ? Not good deal ?

The price being reasonable is one thing, but the real question is whether this is the right diamond for you (her). Buying something just because it's at a sensible price is normally not a good strategy.

Do you (does she) actually want a D/IF? Or is it because you fear that something else will be looking yellow and/or with visible inclusions? If the latter is the case, please be assured that an H/VS2 (and even an I/SI1) in this size will look white and with no visible inclusions.

Similarly for the pear shape - and the cut is a huge variable on which we know nothing but is more influential on looks than all the others we have mentioned.

  • Like 1

Davide - Specialised Consumer Information and Assistance,
Diamonds by Lauren (http://www.diamondsbylauren.com)
davide@diamondsbylauren.com

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Hi David !

Thank a lot for this great answer ! Appreciated !

1. We (and possibly you) know nothing about the cut of the diamond, other than symmetry being graded good - and that's not a good place to start. Can you see the diamond and compare it to others? Alternatively, can the vendor provide you with good quality photos and ideally a video? 

Actually I saw the diamand with her last monday but at this stage, I did not know about fluorescence and what to check with it. He just insisted about the flawless and the D color Therefore, I did not think about asking other questions and specifically,  I could not see well though the UV if it was blue or not. I couldn't compare as well to other diamonds as it brought only this.

2. The report is over 15 years old. This is not necessarily a problem, but: A) has the diamond been sitting for 15 years in a retailer's safe? If so, is it because there is something wrong with it? Or B} has the diamond been sitting on somebody's finger for 15 years, in which case is it still "flawless"? It takes very very little to have a tiny chip or scratch that makes that "flawless" grade go away.

Wow did not pay attention to that ! He told me that the bought this diamond recently because it was a nice deal according to him. So do you think, he bought it 15 years ago ? Or he bought it recently but has been analysed 15 years ago ?

Do you suggest that it's better to do a new analysis ?

3. The reason why the fluorescence has a negative impact on price is that sometimes it makes stones go cloudy or oily in natural light. This may or may not be the case here, but if it does not everybody likes the effect. Did you ask the vendor?

As I told you before, I did not pay attention to that as I did not have the knowledge. So my fiancee tried the diamond, said it's really nice but I don't know if she paid attention to that as well (she was excited etc)

The price is reasonable, and one reason why it is so "cheap" compared to other D/IF 1.0x pears is very clearly the fluorescence, but the polish and symmetry grades contribute too. Take a look through this list of nearly 150 comparable diamonds for Weight/Clarity/Colour and see what happens to prices when you filter for fluorescence, polish or symmetry...

My fiancee told me that I can buy this to get more money by selling it as it may be a nice diamond and then buy aanother one smaller, but with everything you told me before, I'm not sure that it will be easy. What do you think ?

The price being reasonable is one thing, but the real question is whether this is the right diamond for you (her). Buying something just because it's at a sensible price is normally not a good strategy.

Do you (does she) actually want a D/IF? Or is it because you fear that something else will be looking yellow and/or with visible inclusions? If the latter is the case, please be assured that an H/VS2 (and even an I/SI1) in this size will look white and with no visible inclusions.

She told me that she just want something nice and good quality but by seeing this diamond, she told me that it can be a good deal...
Initially she was up for a 0.75ct, D-E/VS1-VS2. Something that can be brillant and white.

So D/IF is not really mandatory.

Similarly for the pear shape - and the cut is a huge variable on which we know nothing but is more influential on looks than all the others we have mentioned.

It is not mentioned in the GIA report ? How can I know about it ? Jut by looking ?

Thank a lot for taking time to answer my question ! I really appreciate it.

Edited by lilouch123

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Davide covered all the important points - which he usually does.

 

3 hours ago, lilouch123 said:

My fiancee told me that I can buy this to get more money by selling it as it may be a nice diamond and then buy aanother one smaller, but with everything you told me before, I'm not sure that it will be easy. What do you think ?

This stone will definitely not be easy to resell.  Unless you really know what you're doing and have a ready outlet for the stone, I would stay far away from getting involved in speculative buying of a difficult product.

Were you looking for a pear shaped diamond to begin with? 

3 hours ago, lilouch123 said:

Similarly for the pear shape - and the cut is a huge variable on which we know nothing but is more influential on looks than all the others we have mentioned.

It is not mentioned in the GIA report ? How can I know about it ? Jut by looking ?

Looking is certainly a big part of the game but even more important is education.  Seeing the stone alone with nothing to compare it to is a recipe for disaster.  It has a very wide table at 69%.  This may make the stone look glassy.  You need to compare it to other similar stones, and I don't mean other DIF stones.  Look at other colors.  As Davide mentions and I differ with him slightly, you can probably find an H or I color ( I think G/H is the lower limit) without seeing color in the stone.  Most SI1 stones in this size will be clean to the naked eye.

Here is a search for 1ct PS GH-VS2/SI1 with VG Pol and Sym and better:

https://www.diamondreview.com/diamonds?sortOrder=carat&sortDesc=0&fShape=Pear&fCaratLo=1.00&fCaratHi=1.18&fColorLo=G&fColorHi=H&fClarityLo=VS2&fClarityHi=SI1&fCutLo=&fCutHi=poor&fDepthLo=50.0&fDepthHi=80.0&fTableLo=40.0&fTableHi=80.0&fSymLo=ideal&fSymHi=vgood&fPolLo=ideal&fPolHi=vgood&fCulLo=&fCulHi=vlarge&fFlrLo=none&fFlrHi=med&fPriceLo=0&fPriceHi=1000000&fLabGIA=1&adv=1

As you can see, apart for a few outliers, you can easily find stones closer to your original budget.  The important part, especially for fancy shapes is that you get to compare the options available to each other.  If you are not seeing the stones in person, then at least a comparative video, showing multiple stones next to each other.


Laurent George
Diamond Ideals
New York City

www.diamondideals.com
212-207-4845
laurent@diamondideals.com

 

 

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That is interesting ! I learn a lot thank to you. Thank !

 

Were you looking for a pear shaped diamond to begin with? 

Yes, she want a peer for her ring.

 It has a very wide table at 69%.  This may make the stone look glassy.

So the table should be less, right ? 

 

You need to compare it to other similar stones, and I don't mean other DIF stones.  Look at other colors.  As Davide mentions and I differ with him slightly, you can probably find an H or I color ( I think G/H is the lower limit) without seeing color in the stone.  Most SI1 stones in this size will be clean to the naked eye.

Interesting ! Wouah it will take longer time...

I will take a look on the link.
Thank a lot,

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If what you/she want is a 0.75/E/VS2/Pear/GIA, don’t buy a 1.05/D/IF.  Here’s 37 offers that actually meets your specs better and the most expensive is half of that price. The cheapest is half of THAT.

 

https://www.diamondreview.com/diamonds?sortOrder=price&sortDesc=1&fShape=Pear&fCaratLo=0.75&fCaratHi=0.80&fColorLo=E&fColorHi=E&fClarityLo=VS2&fClarityHi=VS2&fCutLo=&fCutHi=poor&fDepthLo=50.0&fDepthHi=80.0&fTableLo=40.0&fTableHi=80.0&fSymLo=&fSymHi=poor&fPolLo=&fPolHi=poor&fCulLo=&fCulHi=vlarge&fFlrLo=&fFlrHi=vstrong&fPriceLo=0&fPriceHi=1000000

 

As mentioned in the posts above, selling diamonds no simple task, and this one will be harder than most.  It’s a fashion thing.  That’s reasonable enough, given that it’s a fashion product, but don’t go into a diamond deal with the expectation that you’ll ever see your money again.  Buy it because you love it.  Buy it because she’ll love it.  The right price on the wrong thing is no bargain.

 

Edited by denverappraiser

Neil Beaty

GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA

 

There's never a crowd when you go that extra mile.

Professional Appraisals in Denver

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