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Investing In Diamonds

Paul Sandberg

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Nope. I've never heard of them specifically. But I have a LOT of experience with people investing in various diamond 'investment' plans. The problem is ALWAYS in the exit scenario and occasionally in the carrying and transaction costs. If selling were as easy as buying, this would all be so easy. You're right at the beginning of your exit window. How do they claim this will work?

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Thanks for the reply. Pure Diamond Holdings claim that they auction the diamond portfolios owned by the investors at a suitable time (determined by them) between 3 and 5 years after the investment began (I started my investment in September 2012). Investors co-own a portfolio of precious diamonds purchased at about 1 million pounds per portfolio (my purchase was £32,000). The diamonds are stored in Malca-Amit's vault in Geneva. The portfolio is sold at the end of the investment period (e.g. by public auction or to private buyers), and the proceeds immediately distributed to the investors pro rata of investment. Their projection is that the value of the diamonds will have risen by about 13% (or more) per annum. Here is the link to "Pure Diamond Holdings" http://purediamondholdings.com

Any profit above 13% is shared equally between Pure Diamond Holdings and the investors. 

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I don't mean to come across as harsh but I think this is an important topic. People ask about it a lot. I also point out I've never heard of this particular company and am not singling them out. I wish them and their customers all the best.

That said ....

Public auctions normally take anywhere from 5% to 40% of the proceeds depending on the auction house used. That comes off the top as a selling expense. As a rule, the ones that charge the most are the ones that can get the highest prices. It's a gamble but most of that upsell goes to the house, not the consignor.

Malca-Amit has several holding programs but they'll take 1-2%/year. This would include the vault, the insurance and so on. Surely the paperwork from Pure says what it's costing.

Presumably Pure is charging a management fee of some sort. 2%/year is pretty typical. Again, this should be in their paperwork.

This means a 5 year program eats 10-20% in carrying costs and another chunk in selling fees at the end. 10% is a nice round number for that so the process is going to cost 20-30% of the proceeds or thereabouts.  

Taking a more-or-less random stone and using dates where I happen to have the data handy, a 1.00/VS1/F/GIA/round listed on Rapaport May 2011 (roughly 4 years ago) for $10,300. Currently that same stone lists for 9,800. Rap's a funny thing and you normally neither buy nor sell at their prices but the relationships between the various stones and over time are pretty sound. (Note: There are more than 1000 of these for sale in the database of this site and about half can be bought at retail for under $7000). A 2.00/VVS2/E on Rap was $55,000 in 2011 and is now $52,800. A 0.50/SI1/G was $1900, now it's $1550.

As they say, past performance is no guarantee of future results and this works both ways but even if they're able to buy and sell at exactly the same discount (unlikely), I"m not seeing anything like that kind of return. I"m actually seeing a loss if what we're talking about are mainstream 'colorless' diamonds.

The silver lining, if indeed there is one, is if they can buy cheaply in bulk and sell at premium prices later. That is to say, if they're dealing in diamonds. How long they hold it has nothing to do with it and, in fact, flipping things faster is usually better. There's money in that for people who are good at it but it's a wickedly competitive business and this isn't investing in diamonds, it's investing in a dealer. These guys don't even CLAIM to be doing this, so I think it's fair to speculate that it's not the heart of the strategy.

Edited by denverappraiser
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I'm a tad disappointed that I seem to have put you off. Again, I think this is an important topic that comes up regularly and I'm not picking on either you or Pure. I'm picking on the diamond 'investment' industry.


I want to throw out a little bit about the so called wholesale prices since that's at the heart of much of this sort of discussion.


Polished diamonds are traded at wholesale in several different ways but the biggest these days is a big database called Rapnet. It's pretty similar to the database here in that it's a giant listing of offers from many different sellers worldwide. Dealers pay a fee to be members and they can search the listings on whatever sorts of criteria they like. Members can list for sale whatever they want and charge whatever they want to charge. Whether or not the can get it is an entirely different matter. It's a giant free for all. Deals are made outside of it. That is to say, Rap has nothing to do with it other than the advertising. You see a stone that looks good and you call up the seller and try and buy it. You're welcome to negotiate and they're welcome to refuse your business. There's no obligation on either one of you and again, Rap has nothing to do with it.


That's #1. #2 is called the Rapaport Diamond Report. This is a pricing scheme from the same people. Where Rapnet is actual offers for sale, RDR is a theoretical pricing model to help dealers stay current with the market. It's decidedly different. All 1.00/F/VS2/rounds will have the same RDR price for example while the Rapnet offers will vary by as much as 40% from one stone to the next. That's because of things like cutting, fluro and location as well as non-gemological properties like dealer cash flow, popularity and so on.


Then there's #3. Rapaport auctions. Yep, it's the same guys. Dealers make stones available and other dealers make cash offers to buy them. No consignment issues, no financing, no baloney. There's a closing date and, on that date, the deal is done. Rap collects a 5% commission for putting it together (which is the lowest in the industry by the way). Like Rapnet above, results vary wildly. I've been involved in perhaps 50 deals through them and I pay a fair amount of attention to the process. I'm decently good at estimating results in advance and I'm routinely off by 20% one way or the other. There's a definite crapshoot component here.


So what is 'wholesale'? The RDR price? Asking prices on Rapnet? Realized price from Rapnet? Expected price at the auction? Realized price at the auction? Something else? It makes a big difference. These are all dealer-to-dealer transactions so they can all be correctly called wholesale but results can vary by as much as 50% for the same stone. It's enormously important if you're going to make a statement like, on average, diamonds have gone up 10%/year at wholesale. Even if true, without pinning down what wholesale means, it's nearly meaningless.

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Many thanks for your great replies. You are right that there are storage costs in the Geneva vault (Malca-Amit), which I did not factor in (see below). This, plus other costs, makes my investment in a portfolio of diamonds (with PDH) far less profitable or worthwhile than I had anticipated. I will keep you posted.

At least my contract with PDH stipulates that I (with the other investors) actually own the diamonds (stored in the vault) although we can't touch them, since we co-own them as part of a syndicate. They are held on our behalf by a GDC vehicle called "Pure Diamond Assets".

I do feel "disempowered" by the structure of the investment, since we are only given a rough timescale for the sale of our diamonds (3 to 5 years), with the exact timing decided by the directors of PDH. Would-be investors really should be much more careful or wary with this type of complex investment than I was. 


My contract with PDH stipulates: "An important element of this structure means that the investors own a pro rata share of the diamonds completely unencumbered. So there is a real asset underpinning the investment, which the investor owns outright through their shareholding.....The investment period is based on holding the diamonds for up to 5 years in order to benefit from the capital growth within this investment class. However the Directors of Pure Diamond Holdings Ltd in conjunction with the Investment Administrators will have discretion to instruct the sale of any or all of the diamonds held from year 3 onwards, should market conditions prove particularly advantageous and this serves to benefit the investors...At the end of the five-year investment period, a potential gross return of between 65% to 80% is expected."

Target returns are given as 13+% per annum (NB any returns over the expected 13% are shared equally between the investor and the company). The Trustees (overseeing the project) are Glenmuir International Ltd, UK). The contract says that the investment is insured and underwritten by Lloyds of London.


The investment fees (a little hidden away in the Memorandum, I'd say) are as follows:

Subscription Fee

A Subscription Fee in relation to the Offer has been fixed at 3% of the funds raised pursuant to the Offer. This is payable to the Investment Administrators for services provided.

Introductory Commission Fee

An Introductory Commission of 4% of the funds raised pursuant to the Offer and is payable to the authorised financial adviser or registered agent.

Storage, Insurance, Laboratory Fees & Management Fees

The Directors have allocated a fixed cost to the secure storage, insurance, laboratory testing of the diamonds and management costs, which over the five-year investment term is 7.5% of funds invested.

The Investment Administrators shall also be entitled to an Annual Management Charge equal to 1% of the funds invested. This shall be deducted from returns paid to investors.

There will be no further fees, costs or expenses applicable to the investment detailed within the Memorandum. 


I appreciate your interest and advice!

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To summarize:

3% subscription fee. What's that? In particular, is that something renewable annually or is it just another name for a front end load?
4% sales commission on the front end to the guy who sold it to you. That's above and beyond the subscription fee.
1.5% annually to Malca-amit, paid in advance for 5 years. (M-A is a fine outfit by the way)
1% annual management fee.

Lloyds is insuring something, presumably not the return on the investment but probably theft from the vault and things like that.  (Lloyds is a fine outfit too)


I see no discussion of sales commissions, auction fees or whatnot as part of the liquidation or, for that matter, commissions on the front end associated with the purchases.  I guarantee they're there, it's just a matter of understanding what's being paid to whom for what.  It's not even unreasonable.  Salespeople and dealers want to be paid.  


Do they give you any clues as to what the portfolio actually contains? The category of diamonds covers a wide range from the mainline sorts of things people buy for engagement rings to super pricey fancy colored stones that Saudi royals like to collect. A million pounds could be a single stone or it could be a thousand. Presumably it's a mix but the details of the mix makes a big difference when it comes to the exit strategy. It's sort of like looking at a mutual fund and asking exactly what's in it.  "Stocks", even though it's correct, isn't answering the question.

"Potential gross return" and "target returns" are, of course, sales malarkey. That's ok, that's what sales people are for, but 'potential' goes from zero to 10x. I'm reminded of a giant sign on the wall of my local post office that says "Our goal - 5 minutes or less". Hah! It's good to have goals but it has no visible effect on the behavior or the workers so who cares what their goals are?  That sign is supposed to make me feel better while I stand on line and wait for them but, at least in my case, it's not working so well.

Edited by denverappraiser
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  • 4 weeks later...

Hello again!


I wrote to Pure Diamonds demanding to see the audits and inventories of the diamonds owned by the syndicate of which I am a part/member (bearing in mind that I started my diamond investment nearly three years ago, and I have received no audits or inventories so far). The trustee has just replied to my email. He has sort of thrown the ball back into my court. I would appreciate any advice you might have as to the reply I might make to his questions. I intend to reply to him in the next couple of days. The trustee is a broker and investment provider (called Glenmuir Ltd. UK), and is part of the board of this diamond investment (I withhold his name for now). On starting my investment, I was told that each syndicate (including my own) would hold diamonds purchased at approximately 1 million pounds sterling; many of the diamonds are pinks and yellows, and the total number of diamonds in my syndicate is about 12 (I saw them in the Geneva vault in the beginning of 2013. Allegedly, they were owned by my syndicate)..


In his email below, the Trustee indicates that there are 28 members in my syndicate.The plan is to distribute the proceeds of the sales, when sold, on a pro rata basis to the respective syndicate holders (I invested and remitted £32,000 in my holding, so the other syndicate members would have made up the remaining £1000,000 balance).  I hope this explains it all sufficiently. I copy below his email reply to me, as follows:


Dear Mr Sandberg,
I wish to provide a response to the various matters contained within your recent email. To ensure I fully understand your points, can you please provide a response to the following questions;
  1. Matter of Transparency: Can you please clarify what you feel has not been provided to you in this regard.
  2. Audits: What do you feel should be contained in the annual “audit†and how do you fee this should be produced?
  3. Vague Newsletter: Can you explain what you mean by this. The investment being a buy/hold/sale based investment cannot be so specific especially with values.
  4. Inventory Check: Again what are you expecting see in the form documentation to cover this matter?
Finally on the matter of your final two questions.
  1. A definitive value of your syndicate holding is not possible without incurring considerable cost. Any valuation by a third party would be based upon personal preference. The purpose of the newsletters was to provide a factual transaction value of similar diamond specifications that had been sold via sources likely to be chosen by PDA.
  2. The number of syndicates that hold investment is not relevant to your investment as each is segregated with its own portfolio. Within your syndicate there are 28 investors.
I look forward to receiving your reply to points 1-4 above and will then provide a more detailed response.

Kind Regards,

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It doesn't do much for you to be belligerent with him. You're already up to your eyeballs in this and have no options but to wait for the end game. You can't get out. The only real decision for you to make is if you want to double down on the next deal.  You can bet that you'll be asked.  Who knows, it might work out.


12 stones for a total of a million pounds is some fairly expensive rocks. We're not talking bridal inventory here. You have little option but to wait and see how good they are at selling things. It's still true that the details are everything but there's not much that it would do for you to know them. THEY are the salespeople. THEY get the clients. THEY do the promotions. THEY choose the channel. THEY set the terms and the prices. You bought in and are dependent on them to do these things well. You get no vote on any of it, nor should you. One option that they have that regular jewelers don't, by the way, is to sell them to another syndicate that they put together to replace you. That is to say, no consumer or collector ever gets involved. The stone(s) just move from your vault to theirs.  It's a bit of a Ponzi scheme but in Ponzis the people who get paid off on the way up the ladder actually make out ok. It's just the guy at the end who gets burned. That's not really the auction model that you described above but it's one of the options, and it's not necessarily a bad one or the seller. It makes the whole thing internal with no auction fees.


I agree with him that there's really nothing to audit.


Of course the newsletter is vague. How could it not be?


An inventory check doesn't do you much either. Malca is a secure vault. You'll get out the same that went in, so the worry would be if they were lying when they started. I'm not suggesting they were but, if they were, asking them to audit themselves wouldn't resolve the question. He's right that a 3rd party vault inspection and valuation would be expensive and of limited value.


I'm not surprised that how many other customers he has is proprietary information. I wouldn't tell you that either.

Edited by denverappraiser
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Hello Paul,


I hope you don't mind me butting in - I haven't posted so far not least because I'm in agreement with Neil's comments.


We are missing a few pieces of the puzzle, namely (at least) your email and its questions, and the famous newsletter, but below is my take on what I'd like to see re: the response points/questions thrown back at you. I have tried to stick to the four points as you have structured them, though I feel they are all somehow connected.


Transparency: A complete account of all fees, commissions, charges and levies payable through the life of the investment. In other words, a full net-to-net account of what you will get back expressed as a % of sale price if relevant. If this is not possible because the precise commission charges will vary depending on the resale channels chosen, then disclosure of what median or mode (not "typical" or arithmetic average) selling costs have been achieved in past sales for stones similar to those in the holding in the recent past.


Audits: I think they are being reasonable (or at least honest) in pointing out that a periodic, full-blown valuation is not practical, and anyway it would only reflect the opinion of an expert or a panel, not the actual value "on the day", given the latitude for auction results. This said, I think they could (probably) do a much better job with the newsletter.


Newsletter: Actual individual sale results of ALL stones liquidated since the last newsletter - including information on selling charges (all types), holding periods and acquisition prices (again including all relevant charges/commissions). This is to be presented together with full information of the individual stones being sold - see inventory below. Data could also be provided for portfolios (actual or synthetic, e.g. "all fancy vivid yellows between 1 and 2 carats") of stones, but the interesting information is about the individual stones.


Inventory: At a minimum, I'd like to see a complete list of stones held in your portfolio with the following pieces of information:


Weight (in carats), Colour, Clarity and shape. Information on cut (if available - not a given), finish, fluorescence and any internal/external characteristics. Source of the above information (in-house grading, original vendor, 3rd party lab) and date. For each stone, I'd also like to know planned liquidation date and likely channel(s); if that is impractical, I'd like to be told when the stone will be put up for sale and through which channel once a decision to liquidate has been taken.


FWIW, I very much doubt you'll get anywhere with any of those requests (even though I'm sure they would be perfectly capable of providing the information with minimal effort), but those would be the minimum information they would need to provide to make ME part from my money.

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Hi davidelevi,


I much appreciate your advice. I have replied to the Company and have made use of your advice. In particular, I requested a full inventory itemising each gem in my portfolio or syndicate. I said that the inventory should include the GIA certificate copy for each gem, with details of their shape, weight, colour, clarity, cut, polish and symmetry. I added that the inventory should be confirmed by the Trustee and disclosed to me by him. I accepted that an inventory can substitute for an audit.


I was told that there is a total of 28 members/investors in my syndicate. The syndicate members co-own the diamonds, since the Company purchased them on our behalf (after we remitted the funds to their account), and keeps them in the Geneva vault. Allegedly the portfolio was purchased at a cost of about £1million near the end of 2012. Exit from the investment is between 3 and 5 years (starting from September 2012); the precise exit time is determined by the Company with a view to optimising the returns. There is a Trustee who oversees the inventories and checks that the diamonds are stored in the Geneva vault. However, he has not shared the inventory with me, and I have insisted that this information must be disclosed to me.


Finally, I added this paragraph:

"Since the diamonds were purchased with my money, and I co-own them, I believe I have a right to know the Company's purchase price of each diamond in my portfolio, and that I should be able to compare this with the final selling price on exiting the investment. Moreover, all the investment costs, including fees taken by the Company, are set out in the Memorandum, so I see no reason for the withholding of the purchase price of the diamonds. Knowing the purchase price would be useful for me to gauge the plausible or realistic market value of my portfolio, taking into account the market trends. It would also compensate for the absence of an independent valuation of my portfolio. If the Company decides not to release this information to me (the purchase price), I may contest this omission legally."

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  • 3 months later...

Investing in jewelry, especially diamonds, will always sound like a great idea but you need to be careful on where you invest your resources. There are tons of scammers out there that can't wait to pounce on you even on the tiniest chance they get, so do some research first before you make a big decision.

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Investing in jewelry, especially diamonds, will always sound like a great idea but you need to be careful on where you invest your resources. There are tons of scammers out there that can't wait to pounce on you even on the tiniest chance they get, so do some research first before you make a big decision.

They're all scammers.  There's money to be made in the diamond business, but the key is investing in the diamond BUSINESS, not in diamonds.  Buy a store.  Buy a mine.  Buy a distributor.  Buy a manufacturer.  Buy stock in Blue Nile or Rio Tinto. Those are investments (Although not necessarily good ones.  Do your homework just like you would with any other investment).   Meanwhile, buy diamonds because they're cool.  They are spectacular little things and they make great symbols for everything from love to success.  They last a good long time and people love them for what they are.  They're very popular, especially with the womenfolk.  What they aren't is a financial investment opportunity.  

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Great explanations about how the industry works and why "investing" in diamonds is not advisable for the vast majority of individuals.


It does seem that the kind of vehicle as is being ostensibly provided to Mr. Sandberg could potentially be workable.  However, it would have to include far more transparency and information than is obviously being provided.  The fact that the trustee has to ask follow up questions as to what information the client is requesting is kind of troubling.  If you "own" something (or even part of something) should you have to ask what exactly is it that you purchased?  First of all, I cannot imagine a $1M parcel of 12 stones not all having GIA certs by default.  Why would that info not be automatically supplied to the investor?


The fact is, by listing all the costs and fees and providing all of the data on the diamonds in the parcel, it would be unlikely that an investor would buy-in after doing a bit of due diligence.  And, what is the part about the company taking a share after 13% (per anum?).   Are they also going to share in the loss if diamond prices go south? That part seems particularly unfavorable.  If you are going to take all that risk, you should be entitled to hit a homerun if you get lucky!  It seems like the company is getting it's share in subscriptions,commissions and fees without taking any of the risk.  That's what investment brokers do, is it not?   On what basis do they "expect" to make an 80%  "gross" return?  So many questions...


Anyway, it's an interesting case.  In my time I have seen many different variations of gem investment schemes.  Most have turned out very badly for the investor, and presumably quite splendidly for those offering the "opportunity".  This is one of the more sophisticated ones I have heard of. Hopefully, it will turn out ok for Mr. Sandberg.  I hope he reports back.

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Thanks for all your great comments on this thread started by me. The Trustee has promised me an "audit" before the end of 2015, so I will see what information is released in due course. It will be the first audit I have had (in the three year investment period so far), and the Trustee seems only to have agreed to release the audit following pressure by me. The audit will include dated photos of the diamonds in the Geneva vault, as proof they are still safely held there (dated at the time of the audit).

I will share on this forum the outcome of my investment when I finally have it. As per contract, the diamond portfolio is to be sold at any time between 3 and 5 years of the investment commencement date (with the proceeds then released to the portfolio co-owners on a pro rata basis - i.e. according to our respective investments). The company directors decide on the exact time to sell within that period according to market forces, with a view to obtain the best returns they can for mutual benefit, as explained above. So, that is how they benefit from our investment.

The gems are all colour diamonds (e.g. pinks and yellows). The claim is that so far, the value of colour diamonds has been increasing year on year as predicted. Diamond mines are being closed, with the expectation that the value of good quality diamonds will keep rising as supply does not meet demand. I only hope that the diamond market doesn't follow the performance of precious metals in the last few years! 

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Natural fancy color diamonds do have a tendency to appreciate faster than diamonds in the normal range, so that is plausible.  But They would definitely each have a GIA report.  Seeing copies of the certs should be step one of any audit.


Step two would be to see what kind quality they are and original purchase price for each.  You would then be in a better position to evaluate the prospects are for successful exit.  Just because they are fancy colors does not automatically mean that they will have appreciated since purchase or that they are capable of being sold easily.

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An inventory should be easy enough to accomplish and it should be done regularly anyway.  Frankly, I don't anticipate any problems on that front.


We'll see how it plays out.  The heart of the problem is this.  Buying diamonds is easy... Selling diamonds is hard.  Although it's true that certain fancy colored diamonds have brought psycho high prices lately, this in no way means that your guys can get these prices.  I hope they can.  The issue is important because we're no longer talking about the value of diamonds, we're talking about the skills and luck of a particular diamond dealer. 


By the way, I don't keep coming back to pound on this to make you feel bad or even really for your benefit.  You may make out just fine but there's nothing we or you can do about it anyway.  Who benefits from this are other investors who are thinking about doing the next deal (or you when they ask you to reinvest).  I would like to specifically thank you for sticking around and keeping us updated. Most people do NOT do that and it causes great trouble for the future investor doing research.

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I echo Neil's sentiments.  Thank you for being willing to share this.  I do hope this plays out well for you.  Perhaps if you do run into issues, the fact that you are shining a light here might be of some benefit to getting things resolved in your favor.


Your situation may be perfectly legit, but the vast majority of gem investments are not.  The folks perpetrating fraud in this realm are targeting very sophisticated individuals.  They often get away with their crimes because victims are embarrassed and reluctant to come forward or even to pursue legal remedies.  The people they target can often afford the losses and prefer to take their lumps and move on with their lives.  That makes it easy for these enterprises to continue to recruit new players.


As people in the diamond trade, this is particularly hurtful on two accounts.  As Neil said, this is not an easy business for people doing right by their customers.  It takes hard work and dedication to ethics and best practices just to make a living.  To see individuals taking advantage of well meaning and trusting people is absolutely infuriating.  Secondly, anyone who gets burned on a gem deal is likely never to have anything to do with the products we sell ever again. 


Best of luck.  I look forward to hearing a success story.

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  • 5 years later...

Hello Paul and the community

I too invested with Andrew. My situation is slightly different - I bought my yellow diamond outright and went to Geneva to see it. I have had my diamond 6 years now and put in to sell it 5 years ago. We are currently "the closest we've been" to selling it with a new group. I have positive communication with Andrew.


I was wondering what your outcome was Paul? Did you sell if you don't mind sharing? When was that if so?

Thank you so much for sharing, I hope all is well with you



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Hi Bryony and the others here,

Nice to hear from you. I'm glad to confirm that Richard Chamberlain of Glenmuir (the Trustees of Pure Diamonds) completed the return of my capital investment (£32,000) to me last month. My investment has been a failure, but at least I got my money back. This does not include compensation for my travel to Geneva in 2011 and my accommodation there of course. But it's still a relief!

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On 6/30/2015 at 9:11 AM, Paul Sandberg said:

Has anyone in the forum experience with investing in "Pure Diamond Holdings Ltd." (the C.E.O. is Mr. Andrew Segal). I invested in a portfolio of diamonds with this company in 2012. The investment exit is supposed to be between 3 and 5 years. 

I know nothing about this but would never invest in diamonds. Lab diamonds are becoming more popular and, as I understand, are indistinguishable. As technology evolves, better quality diamonds will be available for relatively low prices. This will definitely have an impact on the price of mined diamonds.

We all heard about old computers and punch cards and some people have seen and used them. Now, our phones are small computers that we can carry in our pockets. One day, we might have the ability to create lab diamonds at home at a low cost. You never know.

This is not an advice but just my personal opinion and I could be wrong.

I wish you the best outcome with your current situation.

Edited by nkc
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