10 replies to this topic

[kwendall]

Hi,

I'm looking for an oval diamond and I've noticed some differences between the cut grades listed in the diamond finders at different websites.

For example, at Bluenile, "very good" is the best possible cut available for their ovals, but Union Diamond lists their best cut as "ideal".

Is this just a difference in labeling, or is there an actual difference in the quality of BN's VG and UD's Ideal? It seems obvious that ideal must be better than very good... but if that's the case, why doesn't Bluenile also offer oval diamonds with an ideal cut?

Thanks for your help!

[davidelevi]

There is no agreed standard for grading ovals beyond a relatively uncommon AGS cut grade.

Your best course of action is to call Blue Nile and Union and ask them:

• Precisely what do you mean with X cut grade?
  
• How exactly are you assessing it?
  
• What impact does it have on the stone's looks?

and see whether you are happy with the answers. I would not be surprised if you weren't.

My favoured strategy when dealing with fancy cuts is to choose the dealer before you choose the stone. Many stones are available on "open lists" to many merchants. Pick someone that can call stones in, take good quality pictures (or even video) and show to you which one(s) are truly well cut and which ones aren't

[denverappraiser]

I think the Blue Nile method is to use a lengh to width ratio with a modifier for table size. I don't know anything at all about Union's approach. No grade is useful if you don't understand the scale and you don't agree that it's measuring something useful. It's like a used car salesman telling you a car is a 'creampuff'. What precicely is that? Is there a near-creammpuff grade that's perhaps more to your liking? Are there subcategories that you should consider? Is there something above creampuff? Is creampuffness even a good thing? Is creampuff mutually incompatable with clunker? Is a premium being paid for creampuffery? Have you learned anyting at all as a result of this grade? Not surprisingly, salespeople hate to dig into this sort of thing but without it you have nothing. In your case, I think you have nothing TWICE and are trying to compare the two.

Edited by denverappraiser, 27 May 2011 - 04:35 AM.

[davidelevi]

As Magritte could say: "This is not a car."

[denverappraiser]

Neither is it a creampuff.

It's a picture of a creampuff.

That may seem like a tiny difference but it turns out to be terribly important. We know nothing about how delicious it is, how fresh it is, or even if it's made of plastic. We don't even really know it exists at all! It may have been eaten shortly after that photo was taken. This applies to the diamond business, especially the internet diamond business thus. People routinely want to choose a diamond based on far from complete information when they are under the impression that they know all that there is. They have a lab report, possibly some photographs and that's about it. That's good stuff but it's not a diamond.

Diamonds are well suited to internet commerce but there are some potential traps that are behind the pictures and I absolutely agee that the FIRST step in considering a deal is to evaluate the dealer. Get that one right and the rest is remarkably painless.

Edited by denverappraiser, 27 May 2011 - 07:05 AM.

[kwendall]

mmmm...... cream puffs...... maybe i should just get her an oval brilliant creampuff and avoid all the trouble of diamond hunting altogether?

First off, thank you both for your advice. I was glad to find this website and have been lurking around for a while gathering bits of useful info (a search option would be great by the way! ) I do have some questions though: What exactly is a dealer? can a jeweler be a dealer? and what are open lists? I realize these questions are probably very annoying for you to answer so sorry about that and thanks for taking the time.

[davidelevi]

Dealer = anyone who is prepared to sell you a diamond. Good 'uns and bad 'uns. Plenty of both. Some specialise in selling only diamonds, but most will be able to sell complete jewellery.

In very general terms, most diamonds on the retail market are not owned by the retailer, but by a wholesaler or manufacturer; the retailer only buys on specific instances. Some wholesalers/manufacturers will have exclusive contracts with certain retailers, but others are happy to sell through any retailer. Therefore a stone (or a list of stones belonging to a manufacturer) may be available to (and often is listed by) several vendors - it's "open".

[denverappraiser]

Both Davide and I have been doing this Internet advice thing for quite a while and there's a vernacular that we develop over time. It's easy to forget that not everyone is privy to it. 'Jeweler' can mean everything from people who sell jewelry, stores who employ them, people who manufacture jewelery or various components, people who repair jewelery, and a variety of other jewelry related things. It's pretty broad. We tend to use 'dealer' to describe people who sell things and it includes folks who may or may not have a store, may or may not manufacture or repair anything, may or may not have a website etc. As he points out, it is in no way a judgement call of whether or not they're a good dealer and it's certainly possible for a jeweler to be a dealer and visa versa. I would narrow it down a bit from just anyone who is trying to sell you something to those who are trying to make a living by selling you something. One off individuals who are selling something on craigslist or at a garage sale are sellers but I would not describe them as 'dealers'.

[hermann]

kwendall, on 27 May 2011 - 05:17 AM, said:

First off, thank you both for your advice. I was glad to find this website and have been lurking around for a while gathering bits of useful info (a search option would be great by the way! )

Hi, just wanted to let you know that a "search" box is tops on the list of upcoming fixes/improvements. We did a forum upgrade about a year ago, and somehow the search box got dropped... I know, so much for "improvements", LOL.

Have a wonderful Memorial Weekend!

[denverappraiser]

Did you spring for the new, improved, cream puff edition?

[davidelevi]

Never seen a creampuff with a search box.