5 replies to this topic

[ppjkc]

We are contemplating upgrading the center diamond in my engagement ring. Here are the specs and price that we were given at our appointment:
3.24 RBC K/SI2 $20,375.00

When we asked what certificate this diamond had, we were told EGL. This sent up obvious red flags and we asked our diamond consultant to send it to GIA for certification. He obliged after a bit of resistance.

Today we were told that the new specs are in, and not surprisingly, the color was downgraded 2 levels! However, our consultant said that the report indicates that the cut is the highest you can buy on the market - excellent cut, excellent polish and excellent symmetry.


Here are the GIA specs:
3.24 RBC M/SI2

We really liked the brilliance of the diamond when we viewed it, but with the color change I am feeling apprehensive. Our plan was to set this stone in platinum, but I am reading that stones of this color may not look so great in that setting.

I'd like opinions on if it is fair to request a price reduction because of the color change with the GIA evaluation. Or does the excellent cut cancel out the change in color? I am having difficulty finding comparable diamonds in my research, (admittedly though, I am technologically challenged!) so I am uncertain of our best next steps.

[davidelevi]

First of all, the grade - whatever that is - does not change the stone. If you liked it before, nothing has changed. There is no "change in colour" - as there is no "change in cut". The only thing that is different is that you now know with much greater reliability what that colour (and cut quality) is called.

Would it look good in platinum? Most probably yes; a well cut round brilliant will not show as much colour seen from the top once set in white metal as it does loose seen from the side. Will the colour be noticeable? Again, probably yes. From the side certainly, but the extent to which you notice it will depend on the setting shape and type; if you were to set it in yellow gold, it would pick up more yellow.

Price is the thorny issue here. For $20K using the diamond finder on this site you can find 3.something M/VS2s or K/SI2s, with excellent cut and no other issues. The excellent cut by itself does not cancel the fact that this particular diamond is expensive for what it is. Without seeing the diamond, and without knowing how much your vendor paid/will pay for it, it's impossible to say whether you should expect any significant price decrease. You should certainly ask for it, and be prepared to walk away if it does not materialise. At least, I would.

Edited by davidelevi, 09 February 2011 - 04:55 AM.

[denverappraiser]

I'm with Davide, I've got no great problem with M colors and it is what it is no matter what the seller calls it. Buy what you love and if what you love is less expensive than what other people want, that's a bonus. M is NOT a defect.

It's worth noting that the GIA 'excellent' cut grade encmpasses 40% of the round brilliant stones submitted to the lab these days. It's correct that this is their top grade but it's still a pretty broad target. Ex Ex on the symmetry and polish as well narrows it down a bit but it's still a substantial range. Go for XXX, but don't be all that impressed that you've pegged the meter.

Pricing is a matter of what comparable things cost elsewhere. Surely you've done some hunting but perhaps you weren't comparing apples to apples. Now you can (this is the reason the dealer didn't want to get GIA grading by the way). It's easy enough to shop the database here with the 'diamond finder' utility and see what the folks here are charging for similar things. I'm guessing you'll find them for quite a bit less but a stone tht you've seen and love is better thn one where you have to put up with shipping and the possibility of a return. How much better is a question that only you can decide. If you're in or near a big city, you can take your specs to some other dealer and see what they can get in for you as well. Hold them to the same standard (GIA only, XXX, no fluoro, etc.). Nearly any jeweler out there should be tickled to take a stab at this deal.

You describe this deal as an 'upgrade'. Are you doing some sort of tradein program with the dealer on your existing stone? If so, those often could use some scrutiny as well.

Edited by denverappraiser, 09 February 2011 - 11:03 AM.

[ppjkc]

Neil,
We are considering trading in my existing stone, but haven't decided yet. We are working with the same jeweler where we bought my original engagement ring 15 years ago. Their policy is to apply the total purchase price of the trade-in stone to the purchase of the new stone. It would be helpful if you could tell me more about why you feel these programs deserve scrutiny. Thanks!

[LaurieH]

ppjkc, on 10 February 2011 - 08:33 PM, said:

Neil,
We are considering trading in my existing stone, but haven't decided yet. We are working with the same jeweler where we bought my original engagement ring 15 years ago. Their policy is to apply the total purchase price of the trade-in stone to the purchase of the new stone. It would be helpful if you could tell me more about why you feel these programs deserve scrutiny. Thanks!

Personally, I'm not a huge fan of these programs because while you might be saving some money on your new stone, the jeweler actually has the bigger potential advantage. Can you buy a car for the same thing you could 15 yrs ago? And diamonds don't have that whole "drive it off the lot and lose 30%" thing going for them. Sure, you'll never resell a diamond for the same as a store can command, but I'd look up what the value is of your existing stone is. If your diamond is now going for roughly 5K and you paid 2k for it back when it was originally purchased (just throwing numbers out there), and the store can potentially sell the diamond for close to retail again. You might be better off either keeping your diamond or trying to sell it yourself and get more out of it. It's trickier, but that's the way I'd go, personally. That's just my 2c, anyway...

[denverappraiser]

Actually you do have a 'buy it and lose 30%' thing going on but it has to do with market access more than it does with a deterioration of the product. Buying diamonds is easy, selling diamonds is hard and most people are limited to 'friend of a friend', craigslist, ebay, sales to dealers and consignment programs. All of these have their advantages and disadvantages but none yield the kind of prices that you can get if you open up a jewelry store, which is WHY some people decide to open jewelry stores.

I'm not absolutely opposed to these programs, they're just an easy place to get trapped. In effect you are selling to the jeweler for 15 year old retail prices. This may or may not be a good deal depending on what you have, what you paid, and what your skills, connections and temprament are like for alternative ways to sell it. The problem is that the stores tend to bundle things together so that it's hard to do the math. They can offer whatever they want as long as the other price is high enough. The jeweler is probably in a better position than you are to find a final buyer so yes, there's a possibility of a deal to be made but it's ot a slam dunk decision like they make it sound. I've got no problem with jewelers making money, it's a valuable service and they deserve to be paid for their skills, but I like to know the facts going in.